"Text Analysis" is an ongoing Cocojams.com series that provides text analysis of selected playground rhymes, and other songs from oral traditions.
This "Text Analysis" page focuses on the African American children's game song "Green Sally Up".
-Ms. Azizi Powell (Founder/Editor of Cocojams.com ; Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania)
last revision 2/24/2010
Mattie Garder, Mary Gardner, Jesse Lee Pratcher - Green Sally, Up
Posted by IvchoBrasil
September 13, 2009
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Posted by taghcrazy
June 04, 2009
Note that this video summary includes what I believe are incorrect lyrics to this song (the line "Green Sally Up, Green Sally Down" is given as "Bring Sally Up, Bring Sally Down").
Click http://www.jambalayah.com/node/309 for selected comments from both of these YouTube videos viewer comment threads.
Also, click this website about Moby's song "Flowers" that mentions my theory about the meaning of that song's lyrics: http://everything2.com/title/FLOWER
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TEXT EXAMPLES OF "GREEN SALLY UP"
Version #1
Green Sally up. Green Sally down.
last one squat got to tear the ground.
Ole {Oh?} Miss Lucy dead and gone.
Left me here to weep and moan.
If you hate it fold your arms.
If you love it clap your hands.
Source: Disc 4 of Alan Lomax's "Sounds of the South, A Musical Journey from the Georgia Sea Isles to the Mississippi Delta" {Atlantic 787496-2; 1993}. Jesse Pratcher, Mattie Gardner, and Maey Gardner are listed as the singers.
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Version #2
Green Sally up, Green Sally down
Green Sally bake her possum brown.
Asked my mama for fifteen cents
to see the elephant jump the fence.
He jumped so high, he touched the sky
He never got back till the fourth of July.
You see that house upon that hill,
That's where me and my baby live.
Oh the rabbit in the hash come a-stepping in the dash,
With his long-tailed coat and his beaver on.
Source: Bessie Jones and Bess Lomax Hawes: "Step It Down Games, Plays, Songs And Stories From Afro-American Heritage" (University of Georgia Press ; 1987) . This book includes lyrics and comments about selected African American children's songs from the Georgia Sea Isle.
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COMMENTS ABOUT VERSION #1
In the CD notes for "Green Sally Up", Alan Lomax wrote that this is "a black children's singing game performed by a group of women in Como, Miss. The slaves have passed on to a modern generation of children a whole literature of children's songs which resemble the familiar English Ring Around the Rosie, but which were gayer and more syncopated."
-snip-
On the "Songs of The South" CD "Green Sally Up" is sung with a slow tempo. The same verses are repeated again and again. Handclapping and footstomping are the only musical accompaniment for this song.
DISCUSSION OF "GREEN SALLY UP" RECORDING BY MOBY
In 2006, a Cocojams reader sent me an electronic message about the song "Green Sally Up". As a result of that message, I learned that the "Green Sally Up" song that is found on Lomax's CD is the background to Moby's song "Flowers". Here is that visitor's message:
"Hello, perhaps you could help me with the meaning of the lyrics of the song "Flower" that was recently remade by the musician Moby. The words of the first verse: "Green Sally up and green sally down, lift and squat gotta tear the ground. Old Miss Lucy's dead and gone, left me here to weep and moan." My questions: Why is the song called "Flower"? Who or what is "green sally"? Is the song a sort of children play or ring game song? Thank you very much for your help!
-Mechtild F. ; 10/3/2006
-snip-
I wrote a response to Mechtild F, and posted it on a page that is now retired from this website. I have also retracted some of my comments in my original response to Mechtild F, including my opinion that "Green Sally Up" might have originally been a 19th century or earlier African American dance song. I no longer believe that. Instead, I think that "Green Sally Up" was a children's game song which might, in part, have similar origins as the well known British children's game song "Ring Around The Rosie". But more on that later. Let me first share my thoughts on the meaning of the words of this version of "Green Sally Up."
The "green Sally up/green Sally down" lyrics refers to the song's performance activity. The performers squat down {stoop, or bend down} and then stand back up. In this context, the phrase "tear the ground" probably means "touch the ground".
I believe that "green" in the song "Green Sally" is used as a descriptor of a naive, inexperienced woman. References to a young woman being a "green girl" are found in a number of literary sources in the 19th and the early 20th century. This descriptor may have come from references to a green ear of corn. A green ear of corn is un-ripened and a "green girl" is one who is not yet knowledgeable about the ways of the world.
I've no doubt that "Green Sally Up" was sung and performed for entertainment purposes only. However, I believe that embedded in the song is a more serious, somewhat hidden message that addresses the attitudes and feelings of many 18th and 19th century America.enslaved Black people towards their White mistresses.
During those times, "miss" was a title that was reserved for White women. In "Green Sally Up", "Miss Lucy" was probably the slave master's wife. However, "Miss Lucy" could also have been a referent for any White female. "Old Miss Lucy dead and gone” refers to Miss Lucy's death. The lines “If you love it clap your hands/if you hate it fold your arms". may have been a coded way for these enslaved people to share their true feelings about Miss Lucy's death. If Miss Lucy was a mean ole woman who left the slaves to weep and moan {over their terrible hardships and not Miss Lucy's death}, then there was bound to have been a whole lot of handclapping celebrating Miss Lucy's passing.
Examples of enslaved Black people commenting without any sadness about the death of their White masters and mistresses are found in other examples of 19th century Black secular slave dance songs. "Jimmy Crack Corn" {also known as "The Blue-Tail Fly"} is probably the most widely known American folk song that ends with a Black slave not feeling at all sad when his master dies.
The American DJ, singer-songwriter, and musician Moby (Richard Melville Hall) used a clip from that Sounds of The South CD in the recording which he named "Flowers". Initially I had thought that Moby's named this song "Flowers" because "Green Sally Up" was connected in some way to the old British children's game song "Water flowers". Here's one version of that singing game:
WALLFLOWER (Version #2)
The version my mother sang was -
Wallflowers wallflowers growing up so high
All you young ladies will surely have to die
[Except ----, she's the fairest of them all;
She can dance, she can sing,
And she can wear a wedding ring ]*
Turn, turn, turn again, turn your back to the wall again.
* I made the middle lines up, must have been something like that
A wallflower is an English flower (related to cabbage and radish) that can grow with very little soil, or even out of the cracks of old walls
A wallflower is also a girl without a partner at a dance.
Do you think that the link came before or after this game with its suggestion of dieing an Old Maid?
-Mo The Caller; 6/11/2006; http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=100061 ; Water Wallflower & Brickwall Waterfall
-snip-
See another example of this game song on http://www.cocojams.com/content/childrens-rhymes-cheers
-snip-
However, I now believe that I was on real shaky ground with this speculation. The only connection between those two songs is that there is mention of a woman or a girl dying in both of them. So why did Moby name his song "Flowers"? Maybe he knew about this old variant of the children's singing game song "Ring Around The Rosies":
A ring, a ring, a raney
Buttermilk and tansy,
Flower here and flower there,
And all- squat!
-Source-W. W. Newell, Games and Songs of American Children, 1883, (1903), Dover reprint). **
-snip-
Did Moby know that "Ring Around The Rosie" rhyme? Is that why he named his song "Flowers"? I don't know. But if that's the reason for that song's name, Moby's saw the connection between "Green Sally Up" and "Ring Around The Rosie" long before I did.
* Visit http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moby for more information about Moby.
** This "Ring Around The Rosies" rhyme was posted on a Mudcat Discussion Forum thread about the children's game song "Ring Around The Rosie". Additional excerpts from that particular discussion thread are included in the section of this page that I've titled "Connections Between "Green Sally Up" And "Ring Around The Rosie".
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COMMENTS ABOUT VERSION #2 OF "GREEN SALLY UP"
The game song "'Green Sally Up" as given by Bessie Jones in the book "Step It Down" is much more syncopated than the Sounds of The South version. The "Step It Down" version of "Green Sally Up" is composed by combining floating lines and verses from "Miss Mary Mack", "I Love Coffee, I Love Tea" and other African American children's rhymes. As such, besides their first lines, the "Step It Down" version has very little in common with the "Sounds Of The South" version of "Green Sally Up". For that reason I think that the "Sounds Of The South" version of "Green Sally Up" is older than the "Step It Down" version.
In the book "Step It Down", Bess Lomax Hawes writes that "The last couplet 'Oh, the rabbit in the hash' may be repeated over and over, either at a steady tempo or speeded up as much as three times faster. The 'Green Sally" couplet functions as a refrain, and may be put in anywhere you want it".
Unfortunately, "Green Sally Up" is not listed in the tracks of the Rounder record of "Step It Down".* However, the description of the song as given in that "Step It Down" book makes me think that Bessie Jones is describing a version of this song that is much faster than the "Sounds of the South" version.
*Click on this link for more information about that CD: http://www.rounder.com/index.php?id=album.php&catalog_id=3576
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CONNECTIONS BETWEEN "GREEN SALLY UP" AND "RING AROUND THE ROSIE"
As I mentioned previously on this page, in his CD notes for "Green Sally Up", Alan Lomax wrote that this song is "a black children's singing game [that] resemble [s] the familiar English Ring Around the Rosie".* However, it was not until I read an old Mudcat Discussion Forum thread about the children's rhyme "Ring Around The Rosie" that I recognized any connections between "Green Sally Up" and "Ring Around The Rosie".
See this rhyme:
Ring around a rosey, pocket full o' posies,
Light bread, Sweet bread, Squat!
Guess who she told me, tralalalala,
Mister Red was her lover, tralalalala,
If you love him, hug him!
If you hate him, stomp!
-Source: Lomax and Lomax, 1939 Southern States Collecting Trip, from Wiergate, Texas: (Sec. 13, Merryville, LA and vicinity)
This rhyme was posted on this Mudcat thread: http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=49672#750915 "Ring Around The Rosey's History?" on 7/18/2002 by Dicho.
-snip-
The last two lines of that rhyme [which I'll call "Louisiana Ring Around The Rosie"] clearly are very similar to the Version #1 "Green Sally Up" lyrics "If you hate it fold your arms/ If you love it clap your hands". Both Version #1 of "Green Sally Up" and the Louisiana version of "Ring Around The Rosie" include the word "squat". Furthermore, the phrase "Light Bread Sweet Bread" portion of the Louisiana "Ring Around The Rosie" reminds me of Version #2's line "Green Sally bake her possum brown". Okay, maybe that's a bit of a stretch :o)
Actually, a number of "Ring Around Rosie" rhymes" contain the word "squat" as an ending performance command. The words to one such rhyme, "A Ring, a Ring, A Raney" are posted above. And, as you will recall, the word "squat is found in the Sounds of The South version of "Green Sally Up".
Here's another version of "Ring Around The Rosie" that ends with the word "squat":
Ring around the rosie,
Squat among the posies,
Ring around the roses,
Pockets full of posies,
One, two, three- *squat!
Source: W. W. Newell, Games and Songs of American Children, 1883, (1903), Dover reprint.
-snip-
If the African American game song "Green Sally Up" was originally based on the British children's game song "Ring Around The Rosie", it eventually became an entirely different song-as demonstrated by the "Step It Down" version.
By the way, see the comments in that Mudcat thread whose link is provided about the real meaning of the game song "Ring Around The Rosie". Hint: It's not really about the Plague or the Black Death.
*"Ring" here means "circle", and probably refers to the children (and/or other players) moving in a circle while holding hands. I'm not sure what "raney" means.
Portions of these comments are included on this Cocojams' page:
http://www.cocojams.com/content/childrens-rhymes-cheers
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SIMILARITIES BETWEEN "GREEN SALLY UP" AND LEADBELLY'S SONG "GREEN CORN" (POOR HOWARD)
A song often has multiple sources.
I just became aware of Huddie Leadbelly's song "Green Corn" by reading this Mudcat thread http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=4280 (Be aware that this thread contains the full spelling of the "n word").
There certainly are close lyrical similarities between "Green Sally Up" and "Green Corn"/"Poor Howard". See this excerpt from a comment that was posted on that thread (05 Mar 98 by murray from australia)
"I have Leadbelly doing it on a CD called "Lead Belly-In the Shadows of the Gallows Pole". It is a cheapie on a label called "Tradition", but that might be a local name for a different company in the US.
Ol' Howard, po' boy
(plays the tune he just sung)
Ol' Howard he is dead an' gone
left me here to sing this song
left me here to sob and mourn (or moan)
Pretty little girl with a red dress on
(above line repeated two times)
God knows, pretty little girl with a red dress on"
-snip-
Also see this version of "Poor Howard" that was posted on that Mudcat discussion thread by Guest, Guest : Music Index / Timberland Library Sys - (15 Aug 07 - 08:13 PM)
POOR HOWARD
(Huddie Ledbetter)
Poor Howard's dead and gone
Left me here to sing this song
Poor Howard's dead and gone
Left me here to sing this song
Poor Howard's dead and gone
Poor Howard's dead and gone
Poor Howard's dead and gone
Left me here to sing this song
Who's been here since I've been gone?
Pretty little girl with a red dress on (repeat twice)
Who's been here since I've been gone?
Great big man with a derby on.. (repeat twice)
Source Folksinger's Wordbook 1973 Attributed to "Huddie Ledbetter" (Leadbelly), copyright Folkways, 1936
-snip-
Here's another version of "Green Corn" that was posted on that same Mudcat thread by Doctor John (19 Dec 00 - 02:16 PM)
Who's been here since I've been gone?
Pretty little girl with a red dress on - or -
Great big man with a Derby on. (X2)
Poor Howard was his mother's poor boy...etc
Left me here to shout for joy
Green Corn
Green corn, come along Charlie (X2)
Green corn, green corn, come along Charlie(X2)
All I want in this creation, Pretty little wife and a big plantation.
Two little kids to call me poppa, One named Slop and the other named Gravy. (x2)
One's gonna flop and the other's gonna save me.
Green corn...
Wake snake day's a breaking, Peas's in the pot and howcakes a baking.
-snip-
Additional versions of that song are posted on that thread.
**
It occurs to me that both the line "Poor Howard is dead and gone" and the line "Old Miss Lucy's dead and gone" may have derived from the similar lines in the "Poor Pompey's Dead" family of children's game songs. Those songs originated in Great Britain and were known to 19th century (and earlier?) African Americans by the name "Old Ponto Is Dead" and other similar titles. Here's a version of that song:
Old Pompey Pansy Richardson, Mobile, July 10, 1947
Old Pompey was dead and he lay in his grave’
Lay in his grave, lay in his grave.
Old Pompey was dead and he lay in his grave,
Oh, ho, ho.
There grew an old apple tree over his head
Over his head, over his head.
There grew an old apple tree over his head,
Oh ho ho
The apples got ripe and begun to fall,
Begun to fall, begun to fall.
The apples got ripe and begun to fall,
Oh, ho, ho.
There came an old woman a-picking ’em up,
Picking them up, picking them up.
There came an old woman a-picking ’em up
Oh, ho, ho.
Old Pompey got up and he gave her a pop,
Gave her a pop, gave her a pop.
Old Pompey got up and he gave her a pop,
Oh, ho, ho.
And made the old woman go hippity hop,
Hippity hop, hippity hop.
And made the old woman go hippity hop,
Oh, ho, ho.
-snip-
Visit http://www.alabamafolklife.org/bullfrog/SongsandIndex.html for performance instructions and comments about that song, including mention of a documented 1914 African American children's version.
Also see page 1936 of the 1925 book "One The Trail Of Negro Folk Songs" by Dorothy Scarborough and Ola Lee Gulledge for a version of that song as well as a description of its performance activity. That page is available on http://books.google.com/books?id=Ys3T_6clobAC&pg=PA136&lpg=PA136&dq=pomp...
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"MISS MARY MACK" AS INTRODUCTION TO "GREEN SALLY UP"
See this 9/30/2009 comment from Cocojams site visitor Gina M (no demographical information available)
"On version 2 of Green Sally Up listed on your site, we sang a diffrent intro as children (I'm 31 now):
Miss Mary Mack, Mack, Mack
All dressed in black, black, black
With silver buttons, buttons, buttons
All down her back, back, back
She asked her mother, mother, mother
For 15 cents, cents, cents
To see the elephants, elephants, elephants
Jump over the fence, fence, fence
She jumped so high, high, high
She touched the sky, sky, sky
She never came back, back, back
Til the 4th of July-ly-ly
If gives me chills to think that we were singing songs past down from
ancesters!"
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Click http://www.jambalayah.com/node/309 to find the same "Sound of the South" recording of "Green Sally Up" and to read selected viewer comments from that YouTube video and a video of Moby's "Flowers" song.
Also, click http://www.jambalayah.com/node/309 to hear a sound file of Moby "Flowers" song.
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GREEN COLOR UP
(an adaptation of "Green Sally Up" by Azizi Powell, November 1997)
The tune for this song is very much like the Sounds of The South recording of "Green Sally Up". However the tempo is slightly faster.
"Green Sally Up" is a game song that I composed which is based on the "traditional" African American game song "Green Color Up".
I composed this song in 1997 for a once a week, after-school game song group that I had conceptualized and which I facilitated with a small staff in Braddock, Pennsylvania. The name of that group (and its sister group in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania) was Alafia (ah-LAH-fee-ah) Children's Ensemble,
An integral component of that concept was that I would introduce the lyrics & performance activities of traditional African American game songs to the children, staff and any other persons in attendance (such as the children's parents/guardians) to see if those songs "worked". By "worked", I mean to assess whether the words made some sense to the children and whether the performance activities were something children could easily learn and could enjoy doing. Besides adding to the children's repertoire of game songs, the ultimate goal of Alafia Children Ensemble sessions was to perform these game songs at community programs.
Part of the group process was to get children's reactions to those songs, and to ask for their input about how the words and performance activity of a game song might be adapted if they didn't "work". This was my intent when I shared the song "Green Sally Up" with that group.
The children's reaction and the Alafia staff's reaction to that song was very unenthusiastic. The children didn't know what "squat" [on] the ground meant. And there were other lines in that song that made no sense to these children. I explained what "squat" and those other lines meant, and even tried changing the word to "squat" to "touch". But the song just wasn't working. After two sessions in which I tried to teach "the traditional words to this song, and tried to get the group to help me make up movements that would correspond to the song's lyrics, one of the project staff, Carol Diane Williams, (who also happened to be the mother of two of the children) suggested that we focus on colors. I had a "lightbulb goes off in my head, moment and the next week, I introduced the group to my composition "Green Color Up". Admittedly this is a whole different song than "Green Sally Up". The tune and the beginning words are the same, but the tempo is somewhat faster, and the rest of the words, and the performance activity are different.
I want to publicly thank Carol Diane Williams, other Alafi staff, and the members of Alafia Children's Ensemble for inspiring me to compose this game song. Here's the way that we performed this song:
Performance activities:
A group of people (children, teens, adults) form a circle. A designated caller is chosen.. Follow the instructions as given in brackets with the song lyrics. Note: the song starts with the color "green" unless no one participating is wearing that color. The order in which other colors are called is arbitrary,
After the verse ends for one color, the designated caller immediately choses another color to call. Colors are chosen in a random manner. If the person in the middle is also wearing that particular color shirt or wearing a dress that has that color in it, he or she can remain in the middle. If not, the people in the middle must quickly move back to the circle, and other people wearing that newly called color move to the middle of the circle. Participants follow the movement instructions as given in this song (See the instructions found in brackets].
Designated caller- Green!
All: Green color up
[People wearing green shirts/blouses or wearing the color green in their dresses QUICKLY move to the center of the circle. Everyone else stays in place. Note that moving in the center of the circle if you are wearing that color isn't mandatory. Individuals wearing that color may continue standing in their place and perform the instructions for that color there.*
Everyone, including the people in the center of the circle, stands on their toes and stretches their arms up while singing this line]
Green color down [Everyone bends down and triesto touch the ground with their have their fingers OR everyone squats down on the floor]
Green color all around the town. (Clap Clap) [Everyone turns around in place. Optional-Everyone claps their hands two times.
If you have on green just raise your hands. [Everyone wearing green in their shirt/,blouse or dress, regardless of where they are standing raises their hands.]
If you do not, just fold your arms. [Everyone NOT wearing green folds their arms , chest level. Participants often strike a dramatic, deviant, grittin' pose while they fold their arms.]
Designated caller: Yellow! [The caller RANDOMLY calls another out the name of another color. If the people in the center are wearing a shirt, blouse, or dress that contains that color, they can remain in the middle of the circle. Otherwise they must QUICKLY move out of the center of the circle. At the same time, people who are wearing the color that was called out QUICKLY move to the center of the circle.
Follow the instructions as given for the "green color". This continues until all the colors present have been called. There are no winners or losers.
*The purpose is to reinforce color recognition, build team spirit and self confidence, and have fun. Given the purpose of reinforcing self-esteem, the rule that people wearing a certain color don't have to move to the center of the circle was put in place because some children were shy and were therefore reluctant to go into the center.
These instructions may read as though the game is difficult to play. It isn't. Children (preferably along with adults and teens) have fun playing it. I'd count it as a compliment if this game was played by other groups.
I've crossposted this "Green Color Up" song to Cocojams's Children's Game Song page http://www.cocojams.com/content/childrens-rhymes-cheers. I've alwso cross-poted it to this page on Cocojams's sister website http://www.jambalayah.com/node/309.
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Please send examples or commentary about "Green Sally Up" or other English language children's game songs & rhymes to cocojams17@yahoo.com for possible posting on this website.
Thanks!
Share! Learn! Enjoy!
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My thanks to Tony Norman, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette columnist, for giving me a set of the four disc CD Sounds of the South. "Green Sally Up" is found on Disc 4 of that CD set. The words for what I am calling "version #1" of this rhyme are my transcription of that song from that source.
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I would also like to thank Cocojams' reader Mechtild F for submitting an electronic message about the song "Green Sally Up". As a result of MechtildF's message, I became aware that there was a Moby song that included the same recording of "Green Sally Up" that is found on Lomax's CD Sounds Of The South.
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In addition, I would like to thank members of the online folk & blues discussion forum http://mudcat.org/threads.cfm for their text analysis of numerous children's songs, and other folk songs including "Green Sally Up", "Ring Around The Rosie", and "Green Corn".
Cocojams - Share! Learn! Enjoy! - cocojams17@yahoo.com
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